Advice needed on a Izhevsk M91/59 in Sportered Stock

[RazorBurn]

I've come across a Izhevsk M91/59. It is in a cut down sporterized stock that can not be salvaged. Everything else is in very good shape, and it's all matching even down to the butt plate. Asking price is $190.00.

Looks like the odds of finding a M91/59 stock set is slim to none. Were M91/59's ever in M44 stocks, and is that something that can ever be done? Anyone think this is something even worth tackling?

I really like rescuing sportered milsurps. After waiting 4 years to find an M27 stock, I've put off restoring milsurps with harder to find parts.

Anyone think this one is worth picking up? What's the going rate for a nice shape M91/59 these days?

[qz2026]

Depends on who is picking it up Seriously, I would say to pass it up if it's one of the more typical 40's variety. If a Hex, I'd buy it in a heart beat and wait for a stock to become available. In that way, you could, at least, have a gun approaching market value. You'd lose if you found and bought a stock to put on the more common variety after paying $190 for it in the sporterized stock.

Some 91/59's were put into M-44 stocks, but not many. Only two of mine are in M-44 stocks. Among the many unique things about these rifles is that 99% of the time they are in stocks specifically made for them. You could put it in an M-44 stock to shoot it but long term the stock would be incorrect unless it was a actual 91/59 stock with the so-called "Czech" box 17 and box 20 stamps on the top of the butt stock adjacent to the top of the butt plate. Every once in a while 91/59 stocks will hit ebay or one of the forums but they aren't cheap - $150+ Already having the matching butt plate would be good.

Lately common 91/59's are selling from a low of $275 to about the $350 range. Lots of guys have listing them for $399 and late 30's varieties at $499 to $599 and getting no hits. The demand on these has somewhat decreased in recent months for some reason and this impacts price.

So, unless there is something special about the gun, I'd pass on it. Shame... I can't imagine who in the right mind would do this to a carbine. If you have another stock you could put it in, then it would make a good shooter - they are arguably the most accurate of the Russian Mosin carbines. If you want to go this way, I'd try to talk him down more and give the above reasons and especially that the rifle has lost all collective value the way it sits now but you could take it off his hands for $100 and see what happens.

Good luck.

[steelbuttplate]

I don't know that it would fit. 91/59's are made from cut down 91/30's, so compared to an M-44 you would have a "bull barrel" where it lays in the stock and barrel band. It would take a lot of sanding and end up so thin it might not hold up.

[qz2026]

I don't know that it would fit. 91/59's are made from cut down 91/30's, so compared to an M-44 you would have a "bull barrel" where it lays in the stock and barrel band. It would take a lot of sanding and end up so thin it might not hold up.

I don't think that is correct but I could be wrong. The 91/59's used salvaged 91/30 rifles. I'm not so sure that they actually cut down the stocks and used them, although anything is possible. They certainly don't look that way. The 91/38's did use whatever they could muster up including cutting down the M-91 stocks. I don't know what you mean by "bull barrel". There is no reason, in my mind, that a cut down 91/30 would not properly fit in an M-44 stock. In reality it's basically an M-38 at this point. Maybe, I'm missing your point.

[steelbuttplate]

I had to check my 91/59. The barrel is a shortened 91/30 ('43) but the outside has been milled down to standard M-44 size. Maybe I'm thinking about 91/38 outside dimensions. I thought one of the carbines has a bigger barrel.

[uberjon]

An m44 or m38 stock will absolutely work. The only difference is that an m38/m44 stock has a little extra wood removed for the rear sight sleeve. The issue is the handguard. An m44/m38 has a bigger shoulder that would not fit because of the longer 91/30 sight. You could use an m38/m44 stock but would need a 91/59 handguard or a modified 91/30 one.

[zeebill]

Look at it this way $190+ for the rifle and you need a stock and a handguard and hardware which will set you back maybe 150+ more. You now have $340+ in a rifle that sells for less or maybe the same amount and it is a put together. Hardly worth wasting your time so think twice and move on! Bill

[racerguy00]

A majority of 91/59 stocks I have seen have been shortened 91/30 stocks. The escutcheons usually give it away. Prewar rear with late/postwar front for example.

[steelbuttplate]

Do your guys 91/59's show milling marks (lathe) on the outside of the barrel? Maybe this is just a 1943 wartime thing. Millman?

[Junk Yard Dog]

That is something very common with late 1941-to at least mid year 1943 Mosins of any type. Speed was of the essence, not looks, some of the 91/59's were cleaned up by their builders but you can see the heavy machine marks under the wood. You would have to have the wood custom made form a 91/30 stock following an original 91/59 stock for the pattern. Expensive, only a total idiot takes the stock off something like a 91/59 and makes a sporter out of it so there are few loose stocks to be found in the wild. I would offer $110 for it at the most and use it as a sporter the way it is. 91/59's are known to be good shooters, that shouldn't have been changed by the stock work.

[Darryl]

A majority of 91/59 stocks I have seen have been shortened 91/30 stocks. The escutcheons usually give it away. Prewar rear with late/postwar front for example.

That's correct. The stocks were "mostly" cut down M91/30 stocks. Some had new stocks like this one.

The stock is not a Polish stock (Polish stocks were only M44 stocks) It is a purpose built M38 stock. Built for the M91/59 only.

Note it is the same as a M44 stock except it has no bayonet slot on it.
This stock was made specifically for the M91/59.



But 95% of the M91/59's were made from used M91/30 stocks.

[B24]

My 91\59 is a 34 Izhevsk in a pre war stock, it has the screwed on escutcheons on the rear slot and
a sheet metal liner in the front. I think someone with half decent woodworking skills could cut down
a 91\30 stock and make it look ok. The hardest part would be getting the front sling slot and the nose
cap right, I think shortening the hand guard would be easy. If it is a round receiver I do not think I would
mess with it but a hex would be a different story like qz said. Good luck whatever the decision.

[RazorBurn]

My thoughts were honestly along the lines of zeebill's. I didn't pay attention to see if it was a hex receiver. I looked at it quick enough to see the 91/59, and to check the numbers. Adding up in my head I figured it would be a realistic $275 to $300 rifle complete. I figure the best I could get it for would be $125. I deal with the person who has it a lot, and I don't see him going below $125. In my head I figured if I did ever come across a stock it would be $150 or so.

Thanks everyone for the advice, and for affirming what I was thinking.

[bunkysdad]

For 125.00 I'd buy it in a instant. I would just shoot it as is but be on the lookout for a swap-in stock. If one showed up in the next 10 years for a fair price then great. If you pass it up what are you gonna think when you do find a stock but no longer need it? Grab it and shoot it. Unless you are a collector with no interest in shooting. There are guys here on the forum with a literal arsenal of weapons they don't shoot, but I ain't one of them. That much I can guarantee you.

[RazorBurn]

For 125.00 I'd buy it in a instant. I would just shoot it as is but be on the lookout for a swap-in stock. If one showed up in the next 10 years for a fair price then great. If you pass it up what are you gonna think when you do find a stock but no longer need it? Grab it and shoot it. Unless you are a collector with no interest in shooting. There are guys here on the forum with a literal arsenal of weapons they don't shoot, but I ain't one of them. That much I can guarantee you.

I hear you. I'm a shooter collector myself. I won't own anything I can't/won't shoot. My collection doesn't really focus on Mosin's even though I'm up to seven of them. It's not anything that's real high on my list, but I'm not one to pass up a good deal on something. I'd rather wait for a rifle that looks like is should than keep a sporter as a placeholder. I just can't get past the sportered look unless I know I'm going to be restoring it back to what it should be.

The biggest thing is that a M91/59 just isn't real high up on my want list.

[millman]

Do your guys 91/59's show milling marks (lathe) on the outside of the barrel? Maybe this is just a 1943 wartime thing. Millman?

Like JYD said, those marks are on a lot of the wartime rifles. They come from feeding the lathe too fast. Those folks were in a hurry to get the rifles out the door.

[entropy]

I don't know that it would fit. 91/59's are made from cut down 91/30's, so compared to an M-44 you would have a "bull barrel" where it lays in the stock and barrel band. It would take a lot of sanding and end up so thin it might not hold up.

My FrankenTula, A 1938 Tula 'sporterized' 91/30 I bought stockless for parts, then tried it in a cut down M91 stock from an 1899 Finn'd Izhevsk I bought at the same time, shot so well that I bought it a Hungarian M44 stock of it's own. It shoots quite well out of that stock, Rongo will attest to that. No sanding needed.

[bunkysdad]

I don't know that it would fit. 91/59's are made from cut down 91/30's, so compared to an M-44 you would have a "bull barrel" where it lays in the stock and barrel band. It would take a lot of sanding and end up so thin it might not hold up.

My FrankenTula, A 1938 Tula 'sporterized' 91/30 I bought stockless for parts, then tried it in a cut down M91 stock from an 1899 Finn'd Izhevsk I bought at the same time, shot so well that I bought it a Hungarian M44 stock of it's own. It shoots quite well out of that stock, Rongo will attest to that. No sanding needed.

If you want a nice carbine there are several on the J&G sales website. A Hungarian M44, polish m44, and a 1944 Izhevsk M44 for a little over 500.00 bucks! Yow!!
Hey these are going up way faster than anything I contributed to T Rowe Price over the years. You should buy the sporter for 125.00 and thank me later.

[SA1911a1]

You are probably getting good advice about buying it for the 125, but I have bought several rifles, not Mosins, speculating on picking up a reasonably priced stock and they are all sitting, years later, in the butchered wood. Every time I look at some of them I cringe.

Got any good deals on an Argentine '91 stock?

[NLMosin]

I've got a 91/59 stock. It has a chip out of it but its from a 91/59 so at least you would feel like you put her back in the right furniture. PM me if you want pics.