The Russian Mosin Nagant Forum

Do you guys know if the Soviets, Germans, Czechs, etc. used any shotguns during the WWII years, for military purposes?

I know the Luftwaffe issued dual rifle/shotgun combos. They were limited production survival rifles, and are quite pricey now.

M30 Luftwaffe Drilling:
http://www.legacy-collectibles.com/long ... rvival-gun

Izhevsk762 wrote:I know the Luftwaffe issued dual rifle/shotgun combos. They were limited production survival rifles, and are quite pricey now.

M30 Luftwaffe Drilling:
http://www.legacy-collectibles.com/long ... rvival-gun

Yep, I would have to agree with the "pricey" assessment. That's pretty cool though, even if it is slightly above my price range.

We did and still do issue shotguns to the military. They have been issued to be used to provide game to feed the troops, as defensive weapons, as training aids for aircraft gunners gunners, and probably a few other things I am forgetting. I own four myself, A Stevens bird gun used during WW2 for training Air gunners , a Winchester Model 97, and model 12 that were issued for WW1, but probably used during WW2 as well ( my 12 was also packed in Vietnam), and a Mossberg 590 of 80's vintage. Shotguns are useful tools for clearing trenches, and laying down a field of death when the enemy is stupid enough to bunch up, during the Great War the Germans so hated US shotgunners that they threatened to execute any allied prisoner caught with a shotgun, no evidence that they actually did so.
My favorite is the '97, no disconnect, just hold back the trigger and fire it with the pump, fires as fast as you work the pump so you can empty it in seconds. Number two is my modern Beretta A300 ex British military gun, semi auto stainless steel gun.

My Dad at the beginning of his tour in WWII guarded German and Italian prisoners of war in Arizona. He said they used 45 1911's, shotguns (don't know what type), Thompson, and M1 Garand in the towers. Don't have a photo of him with the shotgun, but I do with everything else.

However, that is not "in battle".


Dolk

But have any of ya'll ever heard of or seen a Russian, Yugo, Czech, etc. shotgun specifically developed or used by their military? I have a '97 but I doubt it was a military "trench gun". I'm guessing that they all used shotguns during WWII, but probably didn't have any specifically designed and used by the military.

Look up a Berdana shotgun. Russian military bolt action shotgun.

Don't know much about them at all.

Dolk

I just saw an FN made shotgun used by the Japanese on Gunbroker. It was made in Belgium before the war and brought back by an occupation vet post war. The seller described it as a "riot gun." It was going for over $2k and out of my price range as far as weapons are concerned.

Junk Yard Dog wrote:We did and still do issue shotguns to the military. They have been issued to be used to provide game to feed the troops, as defensive weapons, as training aids for aircraft gunners gunners, and probably a few other things I am forgetting. I own four myself, A Stevens bird gun used during WW2 for training Air gunners , a Winchester Model 97, and model 12 that were issued for WW1, but probably used during WW2 as well ( my 12 was also packed in Vietnam), and a Mossberg 590 of 80's vintage. Shotguns are useful tools for clearing trenches, and laying down a field of death when the enemy is stupid enough to bunch up, during the Great War the Germans so hated US shotgunners that they threatened to execute any allied prisoner caught with a shotgun, no evidence that they actually did so.
My favorite is the '97, no disconnect, just hold back the trigger and fire it with the pump, fires as fast as you work the pump so you can empty it in seconds. Number two is my modern Beretta A300 ex British military gun, semi auto stainless steel gun.

Great stuff JYD Love the WWII stories ! & I saw they used shotguns in the movie Platoon but never knew what kind they used in Vietnam

The one I have is a Winchester Model 12, acquired outside military channels as surplus, stock cut back to the pistol grip, heat shield removed, entire weapon was parkerized with a web sling attached. The vets dad made it and shipped it to him in Vietnam, he carried it attached to his pack while humping around various picturesque places like the Iron Triangle, and used it to investigate things like holes in the ground, and tunnels. The tape that was wrapped around the grip has disintegrated, but otherwise it looks just as it did in '68. His dad was a police chief, so the shotgun was probably in the police arsenal at the time it was converted , US ordinance bombs stamped on a few places as most Police shotguns were surplus military at that time.

This shotgun has a fear factor of 10!

I was given to understand that it is a life taker, no details, but the man used it for some nasty work.

Junk Yard Dog wrote: during the Great War the Germans so hated US shotgunners that they threatened to execute any allied prisoner caught with a shotgun, no evidence that they actually did so.

They whined a lot about shotguns being "inhumane" and lobbied to have them banned form the battlefield. They were completely ignored, and rightly so.

sbkittrell wrote:But have any of ya'll ever heard of or seen a Russian, Yugo, Czech, etc. shotgun specifically developed or used by their military?

Russia traditionally had the view that shotguns are for hunting and rifles are for war. The idea of using shotguns in the military and LE didn't really gain traction until 1990's when the "Rys'"(Lynx) pumpgun was developed.

One exception to this is TP-82 "space pistol", the three-barrel gun (two 32 gauge and one 5.45mm rifled) with a detachable stock that was a sort of a machete in a case. It was a survival gun issued to cosmonauts. It's creation is rumored to have been prompted by some wolves finding the lander before the rescue crew.

dolk wrote:Look up a Berdana shotgun. Russian military bolt action shotgun.

Don't know much about them at all.

Dolk

Berdanka is not a military shotgun. It's a surplus Berdan rifle converted to a shotgun, like the Geko Mauser shotguns. Usually they just bored the barrel out. That was a cheap way to dispose of surplus and to produce some inexpensive civilian arms at one time.

A lesser known (in the West, at any rate) is Frolovka, a shotgun built on the Mosin action. It's named for Pyotr Frolov, the engineer who designed the conversion. It's pretty tricky to make a Mosin feed shotshells. This was done to find a better way to dispose of rifles that were too worn out to refurb rather than just melting them down.

Berdanka and Frolovka were popular in Siberia with people who depended on hunting because of low cost and near indestructibility. They were also occasionally issued to night watchmen guarding warehouses and such. Most common gauges are 32 and 28. Thy seem puny compared to 12 gauge, but they were usually used with slugs for dangerous animals like bears and fine shot for small game. A 28 gauge slug is nothing to sneeze at.

White Horseradish wrote: One exception to this is TP-82 "space pistol", the three-barrel gun (two 32 gauge and one 5.45mm rifled) with a detachable stock that was a sort of a machete in a case. It was a survival gun issued to cosmonauts. It's creation is rumored to have been prompted by some wolves finding the lander before the rescue crew.

I want one. If I got one, I'd be the coolest guy here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TP-82

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2007 ... nto-space/