You might be wasting powder. I shoot a maxi ball .325 grain with 90 gr. pyrodex. I've got round balls but don't shoot 'em much. Welcome to the world of nasty black rotten egg smell shooting. The small E-string on a guitar fits thru the hole in the nipple and fuzzy pipe cleaners are handy for cleaning the flash hole. Nice looking side locks
" There are two kinds of people, the good people and the ones that aggravate the hell out of the good people"
steelbuttplate wrote:You might be wasting powder. I shoot a maxi ball .325 grain with 90 gr. pyrodex. I've got round balls but don't shoot 'em much. Welcome to the world of nasty black rotten egg smell shooting. The small E-string on a guitar fits thru the hole in the nipple and fuzzy pipe cleaners are handy for cleaning the flash hole. Nice looking side locks
Should I maybe go down to 80grs or even less? I'm just shooting paper so I don't really need a hot killer load.
The guy behind the counter at the gun shop told me to use 90 but it wouldn't be the first time someone BS's me.
Try 40 grains FFG and see how it performs, your shooting targets not game so the full house loads aren't needed. 90 sounds on the high side, positively on the high side with FFFG, that stuff is pistol or small bore rifle powder. I use 80 grains FG on my big brown Bess .75, rarely more than 40 with my .50-.54's A good rule of thumb if you are unsure of the max loads is to go one grain of powder for each caliber. For example .30 would be 30 grains of FFG ( if it's a rifle) .54 would be 54 grains of FFG. The BP substitutes are slightly more powerful than BP so if you use them reduce by 5%. Next time ask us before heading to the range with it, being behind the counter of a gunshop doesn't mean the guy knows jack shit. It just means he sells guns and gun accessory's. What saved you is the Italian replicas are high quality builds using the best of modern steel, figure you proof tested the rifles today.
Leave it as it is. The ages have been at work on it and man can only mar it.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
Theodore Roosevelt
Junk Yard Dog wrote:Try 40 grains FFG and see how it performs, your shooting targets not game so the full house loads aren't needed. 90 sounds on the high side, positively on the high side with FFFG, that stuff is pistol or small bore rifle powder. I use 80 grains FG on my big brown Bess .75, rarely more than 40 with my .50-.54's A good rule of thumb if you are unsure of the max loads is to go one grain of powder for each caliber. For example .30 would be 30 grains of FFG ( if it's a rifle) .54 would be 54 grains of FFG. The BP substitutes are slightly more powerful than BP so if you use them reduce by 5%. Next time ask us before heading to the range with it, being behind the counter of a gunshop doesn't mean the guy knows jack shit. It just means he sells guns and gun accessory's. What saved you is the Italian replicas are high quality builds using the best of modern steel, figure you proof tested the rifles today.
Good info right here,thanks JYD and I'll definitely back off on the powder.
I shoot 100 yard paper with 50 grain ,in 50 cal ,patch round ball. It will make a difference as to what diameter ball and how thick your patch, is mine likes .490 ball and a .015 patch it has a slow twist rate 1in48".
Some of the guys use a .495 ball and .010 patch,kind of the tighter the fit the better it grabbed the rifling, untill you get to hammering it down to seat the ball then you may be to tight.
Have fun and keep your powder dry.
I don't have a .54 cal, but I do have a .58 cal Hawkins "Hunter". I cast my own conical with120 gr of FFG behind that conical bullet. But the round ball uses a lot less powder (with a lot less kick).
With a 120 gr of FFG behind that conical bullet, I usually get off maybe 4 rounds and put it away. It leaves a black and blue mark on my shoulder if I don't use a recoil pad. But that is a lot of bullet and a lot of powder.
Just for fun or target, I use round ball and about 90 (or even less) FFG. You can shoot that all day long.
dolk wrote:I don't have a .54 cal, but I do have a .58 cal Hawkins "Hunter". I cast my own conical with120 gr of FFG behind that conical bullet. But the round ball uses a lot less powder (with a lot less kick).
With a 120 gr of FFG behind that conical bullet, I usually get off maybe 4 rounds and put it away. It leaves a black and blue mark on my shoulder if I don't use a recoil pad. But that is a lot of bullet and a lot of powder.
Just for fun or target, I use round ball and about 90 (or even less) FFG. You can shoot that all day long.
Dolk
Jeremiah Johnson would be having an orgasm if he had that.. wow.
dolk wrote:I don't have a .54 cal, but I do have a .58 cal Hawkins "Hunter". I cast my own conical with120 gr of FFG behind that conical bullet. But the round ball uses a lot less powder (with a lot less kick).
With a 120 gr of FFG behind that conical bullet, I usually get off maybe 4 rounds and put it away. It leaves a black and blue mark on my shoulder if I don't use a recoil pad. But that is a lot of bullet and a lot of powder.
Just for fun or target, I use round ball and about 90 (or even less) FFG. You can shoot that all day long.
Dolk
Jeremiah Johnson would be having an orgasm if he had that.. wow.
Dropped the powder charge down to 60grs and both rifles (.50 & .54) are shooting 3 inch groups at 50 yards.I figure that this is good enough for deer while sitting in a treestand but..
When I shoot at 100 yards the group opens up to 6 inches which is expected but drops about 14 inches.Is this normal?
I'm new at this black powder shooting so I might be asking dumb questions but that's how you learn right?
So should I sight in at 75 yards maybe or leave it at 50 yards and just do a hold over at 100 yards if a good broadside shot is presented.
Also...round balls or conical bullets for hunting? Dang so much to learn but I'm having a blast.
Round ball is never as accurate as conical. BUT ....they use less powder then round ball.
When it comes to "choice" on RB or conical, it's really about what you are hunting. Deer and larger do better with large conical bullets. Deer do OK with RB. That is sort of the "tipping point" for me. If I'm after large animals, I go up to conical with a larger load. That load is more accurate at distance also.
But, a well loaded PB rifle will shoot very well at 100 yards if you have the right charge and bullet. The accuracy you are talking about makes me think something is either wrong in the powder charge you are using, or the size of the round ball. You should be shooting better then that. Hell, a smooth bore Rev War Flintlock can get out to 100 yards (maybe). I've seen Rev War era "rifles" (with rifling like a Philadelphia long gun) reach out to 300 yards with extremely good accuracy. Just ask the "Green Mountain Boys" from the Rev War. They were devastating to the British at 20 to 300 yards.
You have to "play" with the loads on these things to get the best out of them. Things like powder charge, bullet, and patch (If using a patched ball) all have something to do with it. But if your BP has rifling, it can be very accurate and deadly. I have seen guys with reproduction Philadelphia long rifles and Kentucky long rifles that can out shoot most of us with a Mosin. That is for sure. Just go to a "meet and shoot" some time. Damn, it's crazy.
In my TC Renegade 54 caliber I shoot 90 grains of Pyrodex RS (FFG) at 100 yds and 70 grains at 50. I have shot 90 at 50 yards but it has more recoil, uses more powder, and is no more accurate than 70 grains. Maybe less. I have never dropped to 60 grains
bunkysdad wrote:In my TC Renegade 54 caliber I shoot 90 grains of Pyrodex RS (FFG) at 100 yds and 70 grains at 50. I have shot 90 at 50 yards but it has more recoil, uses more powder, and is no more accurate than 70 grains. Maybe less. I have never dropped to 60 grains
I was shooting 90grains FFFg in both my .50 and .54.Then dropped it down to 80grains.
Now I'm shooting 60 grains FFg in both my rifles and I'm getting better groups with less powder.Go figure.
I have been shooting muzzleloaders for years and they are as much fun as antique cartridge guns, but to ramp up your fun, get a flintlock. I'd start with a pistol. Traditions makes some nice flintlock pistol kits, not too expensive and reasonably easy to assemble (some care in fitting is required and you must do your own wood finishing and blueing/browning, unless you want to leave the metal in the white). Besides Cabelas, The Possible Shop in New Mexico (has an internet site and ships) has the necessary supplies. You may need to train yourself not to flinch with the flash from the lock.
Photo disclaimer: I'm not that
1) thin
2) young
3)good looking
any more. This was maybe 30 to 35 years ago now. My Brother took this photo and won 1st place in the county fair for it.
Flintlock pistol kit I built. I think a CVA kit. One of my first black powder guns.
Just happened to come back to the BP threads today and it brings back memories. I love the flintlocks. Probably because of the Davy Crockett days that many of us old farts grew up with. I've never shot anything larger than .45 in the flinters but did think that using FFFG powder in your rifle was probably not the correct way to go. When I had my percussion .58 caliber rifles, I always used FFG. FFFG for the .45 flintlocks works best. Can prime with either FFFG or FFFFG. This thread makes me want to pull the rifles off the wall and go shooting again. Alas, so little time, so many guns to shoot...
qz2026 wrote: ↑Fri May 19, 2017 4:09 am
Just happened to come back to the BP threads today and it brings back memories. I love the flintlocks. Probably because of the Davy Crockett days that many of us old farts grew up with. I've never shot anything larger than .45 in the flinters but did think that using FFFG powder in your rifle was probably not the correct way to go. When I had my percussion .58 caliber rifles, I always used FFG. FFFG for the .45 flintlocks works best. Can prime with either FFFG or FFFFG. This thread makes me want to pull the rifles off the wall and go shooting again. Alas, so little time, so many guns to shoot...
Davy Crocket was my childhood movie. Watched it all the time. Absolutely loved it, I'd say it was even formative. I was excited to find a DVD copy at Cracker Barrell once and it was just as good years later. Also read all the Hawkey novels (Last of the Mohicans' etc) a few years ago. I've been wanting to get into flintlocks, but lacked the workspace to properly build one. I have the space now, just need to do my research. Wonder if I'll ever get around to it.
I felt the same way about building a rifle. I always wanted to build one but also knew that such things, even the kits, are not for beginners. Then I found Kiblers Long Rifles (https://kiblerslongrifles.com/). I've built one already and have had another one in the box for over a year that I haven't gotten around to yet. Not only have they made the build process very easy but he has extensive YouTubes that takes you through everything even finishing. I watched just about all of them before I decided to order my first one.
qz2026 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 27, 2023 8:46 am
I felt the same way about building a rifle. I always wanted to build one but also knew that such things, even the kits, are not for beginners. Then I found Kiblers Long Rifles (https://kiblerslongrifles.com/). I've built one already and have had another one in the box for over a year that I haven't gotten around to yet. Not only have they made the build process very easy but he has extensive YouTubes that takes you through everything even finishing. I watched just about all of them before I decided to order my first one.
