Classic Firearms

[MosinGunner1102]

Has anybody had a bad experience with classic firearms? just ordered a Dragoon Era mosin from them today, very excited.

[mogunner]

I purchased my first Mosin from them right at 6 years ago and it was in better shape than described. The company was bought a few years ago, and it's been hit and miss with what I've seen. Check out your purchase carefully and if it's not what it's supposed to be then raise Hell and prop it up, you'll eventually get taken care of it seems.

[MosinGunner1102]

It is a hit and miss deal with them. Some people who have ordered the Dragoon Era mosins, when they recieved them, they where not Dragoon Era at all. Some get good examples of stuff from them, others are not so lucky. Out of the 3 long guns I bought from them, I sent 2 back because they were not what they adverised them to be. I ordered some mags for a Saiga rifle. They charged my card and never shipped them. After 6 months after a runaround from them, I finally got the order cancelled and my card was refunded. Their customer service is hit and miss also. I stopped doing bussiness with them. Check around on the majority of gun forums, there is plenty people say about Classic's reputation. YMMV

if its not a dragoon era mosin then what could it be? Just a plain hex receivered Izhevsk rifle?

[racerguy00]

A few people got later date hexes and werent happy for sure. Personally, for the prices they charge and recent issues they've had I would buy off a classified or trader page before buying from them sight unseen.

[capt14k]

A few people got later date hexes and werent happy for sure. Personally, for the prices they charge and recent issues they've had I would buy off a classified or trader page before buying from them sight unseen.

+1


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[Fledge]

I haven't bought from a large retailer in years. I also prefer to see what I am buying and not trusting my luck of the draw. If I didn't have bad luck, I would have no luck at all.

[Titanium Hammer]

I've never had good luck with buying from them & I'm done after paying for a hand select Yugo SKS out of this last batch & receiving a parts rifle that has 3 different serial numbers on it. It looks nice & shoots well but it is by no means "excellent" or "unissued" with closer to being "unissued" being what paying for hand select was supposed to get you according to their video. Their video also said that although they couldn't guarantee matching numbers on the Yugo SKS rifles, out of the crates & crates of them that they had opened up they had yet to come across any that weren't matching. Hmmm...guess who paid for the hand select unmatching good condition Yugo SKS? They are the used car salesmen of the surplus world imo. I filled out an honest review of the rifle they sent me & gave it 3 stars. This review was never published by them & neither are any other bad reviews. They also sent me a follow up email after my purchase asking how they did. I sent them a very honest reply stating all the things I was unhappy about & that I wouldn't be purchasing from them again in the future. Nothing rude or out of line & I never even received a response back from them. Buyer be ware in my opinion, it's a roll of the dice. I saw quite a few guys that received unissued gorgeous Yugo's from them on this shipment complete with log books without even paying for the hand select option. Unfortunately for me, I wasn't one of those guys & I should have known better.

[capt14k]

Their poor business practices will catch up to them. There are far too many options out there to gamble with Classic. Especially when their prices aren't great. What are they charging for a Yugo SKS? I paid $325 shipped for an all matching except rear sight excellent condition one from a newer member here that I knew from another forum.

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[Junk Yard Dog]

They are rapidly running out of future products to sell, it will not be long now before there are no more milsurp hoards to plunder overseas and the supply here is absorbed by collectors who even at higher prices are still buying everything up. Milsurp ammo and weapons will be a thing of the past, a year? two maybe? In 2006 I joked about future Mosin prices hitting $200, today some are $300 for refurb rifles, much more for Finns. When the last crate is opened then it's game over for outfits like the one above. I paid less that $100 for a fully matching unissued Yugo SKS, at the time they were available from any milsurp dealer, it's still packed away in the original storage grease.

[Titanium Hammer]

Their poor business practices will catch up to them. There are far too many options out there to gamble with Classic. Especially when their prices aren't great. What are they charging for a Yugo SKS? I paid $325 shipped for an all matching except rear sight excellent condition one from a newer member here that I knew from another forum.

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$429.99 + $20 for hand select. Throw in another $25 for shipping, $25 for transfer fee, & $50 tax and I'm in to it for $550 lol! Yes I'm an idiot.

[BenedictGomez]

From what I've seen in numerous reviews, the $20 hand select seems like a waste of money. I've seen people who didn't pay the $20 get beautiful examples, and I've seen people who paid the $20 get stinkers. Keep in mind, it takes someone who has expertise and knowledge about M-Ns to know what's worth the "hand select" to begin with, and you have to wonder about that.

[MosinGunner1102]

From what I've seen in numerous reviews, the $20 hand select seems like a waste of money. I've seen people who didn't pay the $20 get beautiful examples, and I've seen people who paid the $20 get stinkers. Keep in mind, it takes someone who has expertise and knowledge about M-Ns to know what's worth the "hand select" to begin with, and you have to wonder about that.

well I'll find out when i go to pick up the rifle from my FFL. 320 was the final price on the rifle and is better then what it is at my local gun stores prices. I atleast know im getting a hex receivered rifle and im okay with that. Will post pics and will update you guys on the final outcome.

[tomaustin]

I expect you will be happy with your rifle.....hex is a nice design...everybody will reach for that one first every time.........tom

[MosinGunner1102]

I expect you will be happy with your rifle.....hex is a nice design...everybody will reach for that one first every time.........tom

Well wish me luck i guess, i hope i dont get fucked.

[entropy]

It is a hit and miss deal with them. Some people who have ordered the Dragoon Era mosins, when they recieved them, they where not Dragoon Era at all. Some get good examples of stuff from them, others are not so lucky. Out of the 3 long guns I bought from them, I sent 2 back because they were not what they adverised them to be. I ordered some mags for a Saiga rifle. They charged my card and never shipped them. After 6 months after a runaround from them, I finally got the order cancelled and my card was refunded. Their customer service is hit and miss also. I stopped doing bussiness with them. Check around on the majority of gun forums, there is plenty people say about Classic's reputation. YMMV

In the current issue of Surplus Firearms, (which Classic supplied many of the pics for) they show a pic of an "ex-Dragoon", and it has a round receiver! (The pic is credited to Classic).

So yeah, caveat emptor.

[capt14k]

I tend to disagree with the milsurps are running out theory. No offense towards JYD, I usually agree with him and have learned a lot reading his posts. However I have looked into the state of milsurps and discussed it with many others. If there is a change in administration and policy i.e. a capitalist like Trump is elected, I think executive orders going back to Bush Sr maybe overturned and then the floodgates will open. There are plenty of Mosins, Mausers, SKS, SVT, etc in storage in Russia and former Soviet Union countries. If China was opened up there would be that many more. Then you have Cuba, Libya, Syria, and Iraq. Lastly if North and South Korea ever reunify, which some think will be sooner than later there could be millions of North Korean SKS and of course the M1 Garands in South Korea. On top of everything in storage outside America there are millions of milsurps sitting in private collections of older collectors. If their heirs don't want them they will be sold on the open market. Those collecting in the 1960s are now in their 70s. Lastly many dealers have been hoarding milsurps see Samco sale. I'm sure Century will be selling them soon. The list contained tens of thousands of rifles. 8,000 Spanish Mausers alone. With all that being said I think prices are peaking and there will be a Silver Age of Milsurps upcoming.

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[Junk Yard Dog]

Problem many forget is that we here in the USA are not the only ones who buy milsurps, the same people who sold them here also sold them to Canada, Europe, UK, Australia, NZ, Central and South America, Africa, just to name a few places were we have had members show up with Mosins or I have seen them in the hands of people in the news ( remember the Venezuelan militia?) While we have slowed importing milsurps other countries have not and the supply is limited. Trump may or may not lift the executive actions, he still will have to work with a largely hostile Congress. After decades of flooding the milsurp market with literally millions of Mosins and other's the supply has to run out sooner or later. War, years of use, neglect, all will have taken a big chunk out of the original supply, there will also be some that are retained by the original users as their cultural heritage. It's the South Korean US milsurp hoard that is most awaited and so far as I know is not being sold to everybody who shows up with a shipping container and sack of cash. North Korea will start the next world war, and probably soon, and probably by accident while doing something like that missile test the other day. The only milsurps we will see out of there will be glowing in the dark and melted to slag.

Every dealer hoards, the smart ones anyway, they know that supply is not guaranteed, not when you are dealing in products no longer being produced new. How many times have we seen Aim suddenly produce Finn Mosins in limited number for special sale? Those of us who have been around longer remember these same Finn Mosins as regular Aim for sale items. The reports from the Samco sale were less than glowing, while I love beat up looking milsurps not everybody is willing to set down cash for them. Forget about China, they have been there and done that. Around 1987-88 China realized American collectors would buy anything they dumped on the US market and pay actual money for it. They knew legislation was coming that would block some imports so for a few years they dumped on our market huge amounts of Type 53's, SKS rifles, even US 1917's we gave the Nationalists during WW2. At one point you could buy a type53 for $25 or less, and Chinese SKS rifles both new made and older military used were under $100, cheapest I ever got one was free. It had wood issues with the stock, and became a "gift" from a dealer I did a lot of business with. China may have some stuff left, but the flood they poured in here before it was stopped was immense, not until the Ukrainian hoard came along did another type of milsurp become more common to see than the Chinese type 53 or SKS.

Older collectors collections hitting the market? Yea, that happens but the days when you could score cheap milsurps from someone's unknowing or uncaring family members are over. Thank the internet for that, with a few key strokes they can identify a type of milsurp, and then ask that question in the search box, "What's an antique German Mauser worth?" The entire antiques trade has hit the internet and eBay, dealers now price things at shows according to what they could get for it on eBay or gunbroker, the younger ones anyway, and 20 years into the internet era that's most dealers now, guys like our Bill who only sell at shows are fast becoming extinct. Deals are there if you sniff around long enough , but damn is it getting difficult to find them now. I once walked into a flea market and walked out with more than 25 guns in one day, and it cost me less than a grand. I would find them at tag sales for next to nothing, dealers would give me beat up old junk they couldn't sell just to keep me coming around because they knew all they had to do was show me a US M1903, or Garand and it was sold. That golden age is never ever coming back no matter who wins the next round of elections, it exists only in my dreams now

What I think we will start seeing more of are "millsurps" produced new. We see this now with M1 carbines and M1 Garands, M14's, it's not that hard to make a bolt action rifle, and likely the tooling still exists in Russia and the former buffer states as well as China. The Chinese didn't hesitate to start producing new SKS rifles when the supply of milsurp ones ran low. The fact seems to be that for every collector like me who values the history in every worn spot, ding, or rust pit found on a milsurp there are many more who value only what looks like new. Appearances are all that matters, not history. This is why a reproduction M1 carbine sells for near as much, or sometimes even more that a real original M1 carbine, ditto for the reproduction US Trapdoor Springfield's.

[Junk Yard Dog]

I forgot, don't count on much coming out of the third world countries. They used their military equipment long past it's retirement dates, they used it until it was so worn out they had to upgrade when the old stuff fell apart. Lack of funding, even what came out of South Korea last time around was in fairly rough shape, and everyone has seen the condition of many post 1968 South American imports. A lot of these countries also lack the funding to properly store old weapons, think the IMA Nepalese palace hoard, most of that looked like it was ocean recovered after 50 years in seawater.

[capt14k]

The good thing is JYD that many of the import restrictions were not laws but executive orders. So the president that removes them can do so just as easily as the president who put them in place. No Congress needed. We never should have had many of these restrictions to begin with, since it was the executive branch making law, and in violation of the Constitution.

I think North Korean regime falls before they start WWIII. They can't stop stop social media forever and the people will eventually rise up and want freedom. My guess is there are millions of Milsurps there. It will suck for the crazies that spent $2,500 on a North Korean SKS, but the time is coming.

I agree that families can easily find the prices with the Internet. However I believe there are more older collectors than younger just based on population age demographics alone. Also since they will be trying to get top price as more people die off there will be more available for sale. Younger collectors are not going to gobble up Finn Mosins at $450. Thus as more become available and Supply far outpaces demand prices will drop. This is why I called it a Silver Age, because while it will be good, it will not be as good as the Golden Age of Milsurps.


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[Junk Yard Dog]

North Korea probably has every rifle it ever begged, borrowed or stole, problem with buying milsurps from countries that are perpetually broke is that they use whatever they have until it's worn to death, then they store it in a dungeon. A milsurp with the been there and done that look is great, but not one that looks like it was tossed in a sewer after being used to pound railroad spikes. Remember the condition of some rifles in the Romanian hoard? I have a few with no crowns left, headspace fails, rings in the midnight dark bore's, massive rust pits and dry to the point of rotting stocks. The Romanian hoard was not nearly as bad as the Chinese type 53's back in the late 1980's, but some come close. Buying rifles from the Soviet refurb hoard was a pleasure, the Finns also didn't tolerate too badly decomposed of a rifle. Buying from Australia and the UK when they let loose the last Enfield hoard was fantastic, everything was so nicely preserved and maintained. Buying from Turkey was a so-so affair, most were OK, but due to decades of use and multiple rebuilds some Turk Mauser's had serious issues. South American Mausers....I have seen Brazilian 1908's that I wouldn't fire on a dare, or for money, not even real money. Mexican Mausers that were just as bad, Argentina on the other hand refurbished much of what they sold and weeded out the worst disasters. Not these country's faults, when you have limited funds you make do with what is available but this doesn't leave much meat on the bone for collectors later on. In short don't count on the third world for anything fantastic in the way of milsurps, somebody posted pictures once of pile's of rusting American weapons in Vietnam leftover from the war, that illustrated exactly what I mean.

I know at least five kids who are hovering over me like the angels of death waiting for the slightest sign of a cold that might put me in the pine box so they can get to sorting out my gear amongst themselves. By kids I mean 20's-30's somethings, and at least one teenager who wants my Persian Mauser after shooting with it one range trip. I don't know if the entire age group mentioned above intends to collect milsurps, but even I didn't get into milsurp collecting until I was into my 20's and had more disposable income. Before that I was a hunting firearms owner and shooter. Older people have more cash, younger collectors are going to watch and wait, just like I watched the older collectors when I was a kid, waiting for the day when I had cash and they had a cold.

Who spent $2500 on a North Korean SKS??? I think that's more than I spent on my first nice car! Then again as I have grown older I find myself less willing to spend money on anything.