First Nagant and got a problem...
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First Nagant and got a problem...
Hi all I am new to the forums and to gun collecting and learning as I go.
Also, I know nothing of wood working.
<-- Facts -->
I just bought a 1928 Russian M91-30 Dragoon with a hex receiver from the Izhevsk arsenal.
It came with a four-bladed bayonet.
It has an import stamp.
I purchased this from an individual.
He only had the bayonet no other accessories like the sling, ammo pouch, cleaning kit, etc.
I bought it mainly because I had never seen one with a *natural wood* stock, the price seemed OK ($250.00).
I know these rifles were packed in protective cosmoline and I know from others what a chore it is to clear it all out.
The seller told me he had cleaned it up, it looked pretty clean and it did not feel sticky.
<-- Problem -->
Now that I've started to handle it more, the stock leaves my hands with a sticky feeling.
<-- Attempted correction -->
I disassembled the rifle, laid the stock out in the sun (I live in Atlanta, 97 degrees!) for a couple of hours, then wiped it down.
Nothing much on the rags.
I then took it into the house and repeatedly wiped the stock with mineral spirits dampened paper towels.
When I started, the towels would come away with a brown-yellow color, eventually going to a soft yellow.
When I finished (hours later), they were clear.
I let the whole stock dry for a day.
<-- Result -->
The stock still leaves my hands with a sticky feeling.
<-- Additional Observations -->
I mentioned earlier that this stock is almost a natural wood finish. From a distance, you can make out the individual grains.
I have never seen one before with this kind of finish.
Could it be that the previous owner stripped the original finish and did something that is making the stock feel sticky?
Thanks,
Richard
Also, I know nothing of wood working.
<-- Facts -->
I just bought a 1928 Russian M91-30 Dragoon with a hex receiver from the Izhevsk arsenal.
It came with a four-bladed bayonet.
It has an import stamp.
I purchased this from an individual.
He only had the bayonet no other accessories like the sling, ammo pouch, cleaning kit, etc.
I bought it mainly because I had never seen one with a *natural wood* stock, the price seemed OK ($250.00).
I know these rifles were packed in protective cosmoline and I know from others what a chore it is to clear it all out.
The seller told me he had cleaned it up, it looked pretty clean and it did not feel sticky.
<-- Problem -->
Now that I've started to handle it more, the stock leaves my hands with a sticky feeling.
<-- Attempted correction -->
I disassembled the rifle, laid the stock out in the sun (I live in Atlanta, 97 degrees!) for a couple of hours, then wiped it down.
Nothing much on the rags.
I then took it into the house and repeatedly wiped the stock with mineral spirits dampened paper towels.
When I started, the towels would come away with a brown-yellow color, eventually going to a soft yellow.
When I finished (hours later), they were clear.
I let the whole stock dry for a day.
<-- Result -->
The stock still leaves my hands with a sticky feeling.
<-- Additional Observations -->
I mentioned earlier that this stock is almost a natural wood finish. From a distance, you can make out the individual grains.
I have never seen one before with this kind of finish.
Could it be that the previous owner stripped the original finish and did something that is making the stock feel sticky?
Thanks,
Richard
Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
We need pictures please..
Do Not Think Of Winning.
Think,Rather,Of Not Losing
Gichin Funakoshi
Think,Rather,Of Not Losing
Gichin Funakoshi
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Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
I second that >>>Pictures help much.
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- Junk Yard Dog
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Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
Welcome to the forum, natural wood as in no shellac? It could be an issued rifle, most of them have no shellac and are dirty. We need pics, clear ones including the markings to give much of an opinion. Is there a gun store near you? Try them next time, most of them will sell you a refurb hex receiver Mosin 91/30 for around $130-$150 and they are still making money on it.
Leave it as it is. The ages have been at work on it and man can only mar it.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
Theodore Roosevelt
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
Theodore Roosevelt
Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
Pictures are a must to determine what you have. We could all guess here but that would be all it is. Is it an Ex dragoon or a real dragoon? Is it an issued rifle or a refurb? Is it a finn rework? The answers to these questions would make the answers to your questions different.
The commerce which maybe carried on with the people inhabiting the line you will pursue renders a knowledge of these people important ~Thomas Jefferson~ (to- Lewis and Clark)
- WeldonHunter
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Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
Isn't mineral spirits a solvent? I mean as in it desolves finishes like shellac. I've never used the stuff so I can't say.
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Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
thought you were only supposed to use mineral spirits on the metal parts of the gun to get the cosmoline out and not on the stock..
Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
I haven't used it in eihter place.
The commerce which maybe carried on with the people inhabiting the line you will pursue renders a knowledge of these people important ~Thomas Jefferson~ (to- Lewis and Clark)
Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
Yes it is a solvent for hydrocabons ( oil paint, grease etc.) but not for shellac. Denatured alcohol is a solvent for shellac but does not dissolve hydrocarbons.WeldonHunter wrote:Isn't mineral spirits a solvent? I mean as in it desolves finishes like shellac. I've never used the stuff so I can't say.
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- bunkysdad
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Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
If cosmoline has saturated into the wood it will take more than a couple of hours in the sun. If you wrap in newspaper and then in a black plastic trash bag then put it in the sun, if cosmoline is on there the newspaper will absorb a lot of it. Leave it in the sun for a weekend or several days. Don't get crazy and start going after it with solvents you are unfamiliar with. 85 year old war guns can be ruined in a heartbeat and your 250.00 investment can be cut in half with a dollars worth of solvent. Don't even think about sandpaper or anything like that. Welcome and be sure and post good clear pictures, or else my answer and everyone else's have little accuracy.
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Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
Not much of a woodworker so that's good to know. I have some gun cleaning solvents like Breakfree Powder Blast and that stuff is lethel to a Mosin Stock. I was cleaning a bolt with the stock near me on the same table and got one drop on the stock. It imediately desolved the shellac. Just a place about the size of a pencil erasier. I got sloppy. Now all solvents are used in the other room at the sink except Hoppes and BreakFree CLP. Now I do have experience with hyrocarbon cleaners. I have loads of Butyl based cleaners around here for degreasing stuff I work on. I even have 10 gallons of 40 year old military stuff that works great on anything with oil on it even guns.Hombre wrote:Yes it is a solvent for hydrocabons ( oil paint, grease etc.) but not for shellac. Denatured alcohol is a solvent for shellac but does not dissolve hydrocarbons.WeldonHunter wrote:Isn't mineral spirits a solvent? I mean as in it desolves finishes like shellac. I've never used the stuff so I can't say.
Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
I am not much of a woodworker either - I am a mechanical engineer.WeldonHunter wrote:
.... Not much of a woodworker so that's good to know.
"I spent most of my money on beer and women. The rest I just wasted."
Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
I have been known to work with ....... "WOOD" ..... In the past
The commerce which maybe carried on with the people inhabiting the line you will pursue renders a knowledge of these people important ~Thomas Jefferson~ (to- Lewis and Clark)
- etprescottazusa91
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Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
I have rifles that leech cosmoline from the stock when hot after twenty years.bunkysdad wrote:If cosmoline has saturated into the wood it will take more than a couple of hours in the sun. If you wrap in newspaper and then in a black plastic trash bag then put it in the sun, if cosmoline is on there the newspaper will absorb a lot of it. Leave it in the sun for a weekend or several days. Don't get crazy and start going after it with solvents you are unfamiliar with. 85 year old war guns can be ruined in a heartbeat and your 250.00 investment can be cut in half with a dollars worth of solvent. Don't even think about sandpaper or anything like that. Welcome and be sure and post good clear pictures, or else my answer and everyone else's have little accuracy.
"Fast is fine, But accuracy is everything" Wyatt Earp
"This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!"
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"This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!"
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- Junk Yard Dog
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Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
One of my French Berthiers had been stored in a block of grease when I got it. Despite sitting in the sun, and having been shot many times and even cleanings with kotton klenser it will still leech a little oil. I took it out of it's grease cocoon 25 years ago.
Leave it as it is. The ages have been at work on it and man can only mar it.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
Theodore Roosevelt
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
Theodore Roosevelt
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Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
ok, I am working on getting pics of the rifle.
It may be a couple of days; but, I will get them up...
Lots of replies, thanks many for your help...and again I am working on the pictures.
Richard
It may be a couple of days; but, I will get them up...
Lots of replies, thanks many for your help...and again I am working on the pictures.
Richard
Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
From what I have seen with my rifles and others I have worked on as an apprentice smith, as well as learned from veteran smiths... These old military rifles will leech cosmoline for ever if the cosmoline has completely saturated the stock. A trick I've been taught to help that is to wipe the furniture down with a very small amount of hoppes all weather gun oil. Aprently it not only protects and moisturizes the furniture but pushes the cosmoline out over time. The key is to use just enough that the stock feel dry once your done wiping it down if it feels greasy you used way too much. The way I was taught was to run a very light bead line down the furniture from for end to butt on each side and work it all the way around with a shop towel(red cotton not disposable paper shop towels). I have found it has reduced the leech quite a bit on my rifles I generally only see it now when I shoot enough to get the barrel really hot. I blot the cosmoline off immediately after shooting and clean the rifle as soon as I get home. Be sure to pull the rifle down and gently clean the interior of the furniture as well. Just my
As they say the pen is mightier than the sword...however that also means the pen is far more dangerous than the sword. The sword can take your life or your limb but can not take your freedom, the pen can. A wary patriot watches the pen as it can steal his freedom. The wary patriot knows he can use the pen to take power from those who wish to use the pen for evil, but keeps his rifle close by his side "just in case"!
- Junk Yard Dog
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Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
Kotton Klenser, it's available online, just google the name. This will remove all the crap from the surface of the wood, it will even draw out some of the hidden crap, and it will not harm the finish. This is what I use on antique shellac covered Victrola cabinets , some of these machines cost twenty 91/30 refurbs.
Leave it as it is. The ages have been at work on it and man can only mar it.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
Theodore Roosevelt
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
Theodore Roosevelt
Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
Aha so that's how you afford all those MosinsJunk Yard Dog wrote:Kotton Klenser, it's available online, just google the name. This will remove all the crap from the surface of the wood, it will even draw out some of the hidden crap, and it will not harm the finish. This is what I use on antique shellac covered Victrola cabinets , some of these machines cost twenty 91/30 refurbs.
As they say the pen is mightier than the sword...however that also means the pen is far more dangerous than the sword. The sword can take your life or your limb but can not take your freedom, the pen can. A wary patriot watches the pen as it can steal his freedom. The wary patriot knows he can use the pen to take power from those who wish to use the pen for evil, but keeps his rifle close by his side "just in case"!
- Junk Yard Dog
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Re: First Nagant and got a problem...
No, it's why I couldn't afford more than what I have
Leave it as it is. The ages have been at work on it and man can only mar it.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
Theodore Roosevelt
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
Theodore Roosevelt