Long term storage/stock cracking

[mproko]

Thanks In advance for any help. Over the last few years I’ve transitioned the stuff I don’t shoot regularly into zerust vci bags. Before hand I do a thorough clean with clp and wax the outside exposed metal with renaissance wax. I took two Finns out and noticed small hairline stock cracks one of which definitely wasn’t there. Even if it was there and I somehow overlooked Im now concerned I could be doing something wrong. It seems the consensus is oil is bad for stocks and I especially don’t let it seep in from the action during storage. Is this something a basic lemon oil think guitar fretboard oil would have helped?

Also Is this something a vci bag could have caused?

I can’t really make the temp more constant. Some places have suggested storing the stocks and metal separate but that just feels unappealing.


They’ve just been stored in a locked gun cabinet. Temp of the room probably goes from about 65-78 depending on season but def a gradual change regardless.
Any ideas of what I can do better?

[Junk Yard Dog]

Almost 30 years of storing rifles when not in use and I never had that happen. Could be the bags, I never used them so I am not familiar with the things they do. I spray the metal with cosmoline spray available on the Cosmoline website, it dry's to the typical wax like coating. Then into large green contractor trash bags that I tape tightly to the rifle sealing out air flow. In this manner I have had firearms in storage for as long as 20 years at a time without any problems, and this is a humid place 6-7 months of the year. They come out of storage smelling as if I just applied the cosmoline despite it being many years. Simple, cheap, efficient, but time consuming to remove all the cosmoline before shooting. WD-40 and a rag take it off easily enough. I have seen both commercial and military rifles that sat in closets unprotected for many decades that didn't have any wood issues, some rust speckling on metal, but good wood. That even includes cheap .22's, and 70's BP replicas.

[mproko]

Thank you. Yeah it’s very strange. One thing I can think of is the safe gets too dry humidity wise. Perhaps home heating and upstate ny winter dried them out like my sinuses.

Another theory I have going is that the Finns crack more to begin with than other mill surp stuff and that when the wood expanded or contracted around the tang it brought us to this moment.

Since I realized what guns were as a kid I maintained my dads then my own collection and in 25 years this is the first such issue. Had slight rust on one a few years ago due to a poor storage decision. Ironically cracks come after I put more thought into storage.

Years ago I stopped putting anything on the stocks themself out of fear it would cause them to soften and crack. Perhaps I go back to the lemon oil I use on guitar fretboards. If it’s safe enough for rosewood…

[Junk Yard Dog]

I only spray down the metal, never the wood or it's forever to get it out. The rifles are sealed from the air once in the bags and taped up, humid or dry. I am in upstate NY, some are in heated storage, others not, doesn't seem to make any difference. I haven't had cracking issues with the antique Victrolas either, and they are out in the air. It got dry enough in here this winter to give me dry eye, not a fun situation, I would rather the stocks crack than have this again. I suspect the artificial air drying coupled with whatever chemical is in the bags is doing something to the wood. Remember how the commies and the Finn's preserved these rifles, axle grease, and later desiccant paper in the crates after the refurb. Crude, but it worked.

[WeldonHunter]

I've never had an issue like this either. I have my firearms in safes. I'm in northern Louisiana and have 18 Mosin Nagants among other types of rifles. I used to have them all in racks on the wall for years before I got the safes. The house temp. can go from the low 60s to as much as 85 and humidity in the safes varies from low 40s to as much as 65% at times. The rifles are uncovered and in standing racks. I pull them out from time to time and wipe them down with Breakfree CLP, sometimes years in between, as well as running an oiled patch through the bores. I wipe the whole rifle down, stock and all. Never had an issue like this or rust. I did buy two large desiccant canisters, one for each safe, that are rechargeable by putting them in the oven but they seemed to have lost their potency over the years. I did add a few 15w florescent lights that I turn on when the humidity is up. I have them sitting bulb side up on the rack between the rifles. They use the same wattage roughly as a golden rod and bring the temp in the safes up a few degrees and lower the humidity back to about 40 to 50%. I only used them instead of a golden rod type heater as an experiment to see what difference those things actually make. They did help some so I just kept them in there instead of buying the actual heaters. I had them laying around so why not. You mentioned cracking on the stocks at the tangs. I've read some people loosen the two screws that hold the receiver to the stock when the rifles are being stored. That's Mosin Nagants so other rifles would have to be dealt with according to how they're fastened to the stocks.

[tomaustin]

how long was it in that bag before you took a look..?

[mproko]

At jyd I had a real bad case of dry eye too. Staring at a computer for work and wearing a mask which blew my breath at my eyes def didn’t help that last year

Probably in the bags for about a year mabey 2. Checked every other rifle I had. Everything else is fine. Also some other stuff that I had that already had cracks previous to my ownership had stayed the same.

I’m also wondering if the stocks just got too dry and the bags actually have 0 contribution to it. The russian mosins were perhaps protected better due to their gobs of shellac during their refurbishments.

I’m reluctant to use the bags for mill surps now. For the black synthetic stuff I still will.

I use renisassance wax for the exterior metal of the stuff I don’t regularly use and clp for all the actions internals.

I ordered some hygrometers for the safe/cabinet.

[millman]

At jyd I had a real bad case of dry eye too. Staring at a computer for work and wearing a mask which blew my breath at my eyes def didn’t help that last year

Probably in the bags for about a year mabey 2. Checked every other rifle I had. Everything else is fine. Also some other stuff that I had that already had cracks previous to my ownership had stayed the same.

I’m also wondering if the stocks just got too dry and the bags actually have 0 contribution to it. The russian mosins were perhaps protected better due to their gobs of shellac during their refurbishments.

I’m reluctant to use the bags for mill surps now. For the black synthetic stuff I still will.

I use renisassance wax for the exterior metal of the stuff I don’t regularly use and clp for all the actions internals.

I ordered some hygrometers for the safe/cabinet.

I too have read every type of advice about storing rifles. This is what I have found. For deep storage, Jyds advice on the spray shit and wrap is spot on. For normal, in the safe, on the rack. Clean it if you shoot it, and rub the entire thing down with remoil or ballistol. Use a shaving brush to apply you oil. Spray or pour on the brush and brush it on. The brush will deposit oil where your oily rag won't reach. What looks oily when you put it away will look fine when you pull it out a year later. Plus no cracks

[mproko]

At jyd I had a real bad case of dry eye too. Staring at a computer for work and wearing a mask which blew my breath at my eyes def didn’t help that last year

Probably in the bags for about a year mabey 2. Checked every other rifle I had. Everything else is fine. Also some other stuff that I had that already had cracks previous to my ownership had stayed the same.

I’m also wondering if the stocks just got too dry and the bags actually have 0 contribution to it. The russian mosins were perhaps protected better due to their gobs of shellac during their refurbishments.

I’m reluctant to use the bags for mill surps now. For the black synthetic stuff I still will.

I use renisassance wax for the exterior metal of the stuff I don’t regularly use and clp for all the actions internals.

I ordered some hygrometers for the safe/cabinet.

I too have read every type of advice about storing rifles. This is what I have found. For deep storage, Jyds advice on the spray shit and wrap is spot on. For normal, in the safe, on the rack. Clean it if you shoot it, and rub the entire thing down with remoil or ballistol. Use a shaving brush to apply you oil. Spray or pour on the brush and brush it on. The brush will deposit oil where your oily rag won't reach. What looks oily when you put it away will look fine when you pull it out a year later. Plus no cracks

Thanks. I just needed someone to tell me that was ok with the ballistol. Just glad it was two rifles and not more but wish it hadn’t been the Finn ones.

[Junk Yard Dog]

I can't claim credit for coming up with the cosmoline in wrap idea, Uncle Sam came up with it first. Cosmoline is how the government stored just about anything metal from small hand tools to tanks. I am still getting in the occasional part for my M37 Dodge that is perfectly preserved in cosmoline put on in the 1950's. The best way yet that I have found for preserving metal. You can still even get Cosmoline in the solid blocks that need to be melted down before application, good stuff for long term storage. Note I said long term, this stuff will preserve for the ages, but is time consuming to remove, so if it's just for a few weeks I would use oil on a rag wiped on metal. Months and years, decades, century's, yea, then I use cosmoline on everything from guns to spare car and truck parts.

[mproko]

Yeah I’m considering just cosmolining the stuff that I don’t use often and putting back in the safe. I have some rifles in the back I never took out of the cosmoline from purchase and they seem fine. I basically shoot the same 3 millsurps at the range so they will stay oiled.

[mproko]

I can't claim credit for coming up with the cosmoline in wrap idea, Uncle Sam came up with it first. Cosmoline is how the government stored just about anything metal from small hand tools to tanks. I am still getting in the occasional part for my M37 Dodge that is perfectly preserved in cosmoline put on in the 1950's. The best way yet that I have found for preserving metal. You can still even get Cosmoline in the solid blocks that need to be melted down before application, good stuff for long term storage. Note I said long term, this stuff will preserve for the ages, but is time consuming to remove, so if it's just for a few weeks I would use oil on a rag wiped on metal. Months and years, decades, century's, yea, then I use cosmoline on everything from guns to spare car and truck parts.

Do you just lather the cosmoline over the rifle stocks too?

[Junk Yard Dog]

I can't claim credit for coming up with the cosmoline in wrap idea, Uncle Sam came up with it first. Cosmoline is how the government stored just about anything metal from small hand tools to tanks. I am still getting in the occasional part for my M37 Dodge that is perfectly preserved in cosmoline put on in the 1950's. The best way yet that I have found for preserving metal. You can still even get Cosmoline in the solid blocks that need to be melted down before application, good stuff for long term storage. Note I said long term, this stuff will preserve for the ages, but is time consuming to remove, so if it's just for a few weeks I would use oil on a rag wiped on metal. Months and years, decades, century's, yea, then I use cosmoline on everything from guns to spare car and truck parts.

Do you just lather the cosmoline over the rifle stocks too?

No, getting cosmoline out of wood is not easy, and not needed, I just put it on the metal parts after removing them from the wood.

[steelbuttplate]

Yeah I’m considering just cosmolining the stuff that I don’t use often and putting back in the safe. I have some rifles in the back I never took out of the cosmoline from purchase and they seem fine. I basically shoot the same 3 millsurps at the range so they will stay oiled.

Then you have to clean off cosmoline next time you use it. I keep a shop rag damp with STP to wipe the metal with, puts a real thin oil coat on that contains silicone.

[mogunner]

I used to keep mine in an old refrigerator that I had fixed up for that purpose, had a hygrometer in it so I could monitor the humidity, you want SOME moisture for the wood but not too much or you get the usual problems like mold and mildew.
From the NRA museum:

Temperature
Ideally, you should store your collection year-round at about 70 degrees
Fahrenheit. Variations in temperature cause wood stocks to expand and
contract. While wood is flexible, too much flexing from temperature
changes can result in permanent cracks. Keep the temperature
constant.
Humidity
A middle ground figure of 50% relative humidity caters to both wood and
metal components. Too much humidity and the metal parts corrode.
Too little and stocks start cracking. Keep the humidity consistent.

Keep your environment as stable as possible. Consider buying a humidifier for those winter
months. If you are in a humid environment, consider getting a dehumidifier to lower humidity.
What you are attempting to do is to establish a “plateau” of stability in temperature and
humidity. Remember – it is the variation in temperature or humidity that can cause stocks to
swell or contract.

[Darryl]

What I can't figure out is, unless you humidity and temp is way out of wack, why does a rifle that is 65 plus years old "START" to dry out all of a sudden and start things like cracking?

These rifle were never put in a "special bag" or even a special place to keep them and certainly not iin the last 40 years or so.

Mine are in mygunroom closet. No problems. I keep the metal wiped down with a good gun oil and a bit down the barrel.

Darryl

[IDguy]

Get some VCI paper from amazon in a big roll. When you put the rifles in the safe or cabinet or whatever for storage, dont put them in VCI bags.

I have wrapped some guns in VCI paper and it seems to take the moisture out of them, especially when dessicant is around.

For storage, place a sheet or 2 of VCI paper in the top of the gun safe. It works like a charm and doesn't mess with the guns.

Or cosmoline as posted above.

[mproko]

Update 1 year later…

I’m of the thought that if I store stuff right a year at a time is appropriate for maintenance (obviously anything I hunt with carry or take to the range gets dealt with at the time of use). I may be able to go longer with pistols which I still keep in vci bags, but I enjoy watching war movies and cleaning my firearms. I’ve done away with the vci bags for rifles with wood stocks. Anything that’s plastic is still good to go.

No new cracks have developed and the old cracks are stable. I picked up a Russian stock to throw the Finn 91/30 in when it goes to the range so I don’t worsen the original stock crack. It’s a very nice shooter so reluctant to retire it completely.

Storage is now an extremely light ballistol on the wood stock. Clp on the innards and barrel and ren wax on the outer metal surfaces. I recognize heavy oiling can soften a stock but this is a light coat. I do use vci capsules as well as desiccants in my safe. As a word of caution ballistol should be kept away from nickel finishes. Unlike the stock cracks I did not learn this the hard way.

Someone posted that the Vci bags can over dry out wood. I suspect that is the case or overzealous tightening when I put back together initially.

I appreciate all of your previous feedback.