M1 Garand fair price?

[ffuries]

I would definitely get the certification needed, and go the CMP route for your future Garand purchases if there will be. What you'll save can be used to buy multiple Garands through them versus a single one on the secondary market.

Plus you can always visit the North or the South store and buy one in person. Don't know if they are open again or what, but a lot of people like it. You can handle your gun in person, ask questions, get answers etc before you pull the trigger per se.

[Jbob]

I would definitely get the certification needed, and go the CMP route for your future Garand purchases if there will be. What you'll save can be used to buy multiple Garands through them versus a single one on the secondary market.

Plus you can always visit the North or the South store and buy one in person. Don't know if they are open again or what, but a lot of people like it. You can handle your gun in person, ask questions, get answers etc before you pull the trigger per se.

This is what I did on my first M1 purchase. The county range I'm a member of was okayed and they wanted to see my carry permit. Wasn't much to it really. I then made the 10 hour round trip drive to pick out what I wanted at Camp Perry. A like new rifle at that time was $950.oo and I wanted to have it in my hands. Came down to looking at many alike rifles and picking the best looking wood grain.

[matt167]

So far, I'm only keeping one rifle of every type, so this one should do

FWIW, The CMP $750 gun that is available now is Special Rack grade, so a rough gun that had to be repaired. The $1,000 gun is essentially what I bought minus I got a good original USGI barrel, and not a Criterion which the CMP uses. All in all, the price was relative.

I'm nowhere near the CMP so cherry picking a rifle wouldn't be possible.. But I will be at the range with the Garand at least a few times, and I could probably complete the certification with it actually, although it would be cheaper to complete with a .22LR

[matt167]

What is the general thought on changing the gas plug ( keeping original of course ) out for an adjustable one to be able to run regular 150 grain hunting rounds?. I generally never even consider modifying surplus firearms even if it's reversible as this mod is fully, but M1 Garand loads are not always on the shelf. I found some Turkish surplus for the time being

[tomaustin]

please remember these weapons were developed with the technology of ww2 and korea...do not expect to make a different weapon by screwing around with the original and juicing it up.......enjoy it for the finest weapon of its day.....

[matt167]

Wasn't even considering trying to juice it up. I don't play that game with milsurps. just trying to reduce the gas pressure for loads that are just over the limit. Since the M2 ball is spec'd at ~2700 FPS with a 150 grain FMJ projectile and something like 48 grains of 4895 powder. Every ammo manufacture does make M1 safe ammo but it's hard to find, and the gas plugs always come up. It seems like the regular Federal American Eagle 150gr FMJ is just over the gas pressure of the regular M2 ball ( the USGI AP round is a little hotter of course ), and a vented/ ported gas plug seems to bring that down to safe levels for the op- rod according to Garand Gear.

This is the plug I was considering. Not for anything over 150 grain loads that are close to M2 ball https://www.midwayusa.com/product/100471950

[tomaustin]

My statement came out a little too harsh toward you...sorry...if you don't use some new plug, firing the garand with the original plug and modern ammo will certainly bend the operating rod by slamming it back and deforming it...there are not any replacement operating rods of the original manufacture which essentially changes the value and authenticity of your special weapon...

The Garand guru's over at the CMP forum do not recommend the adjustable gas plug. Modern ammo is simply too high pressure for the Garand. It was designed to use ammo from 1903. That said, surplus ammo from the CMP is probably still the best deal available in quality mil-surplus ammo.Mar 14, 2010

That being said, the best I know about for the shortage of original ammo and forcing you to shoot the newer ammo is the one I have on one of mine....I was firing one of my garands at the Big Sandy Shoot in Arizona and the plug became dislodged and went down range never to be seen again......after the shoot, I began my search of how to get it fixed...this one below I found and called them up to see how well they would work....the company was fairly new and had come up with a good design...i ordered two, put one in the aforementioned garand, and it has worked beautifully ever since....

This one is a fixed port plug....it does not allow the pressures to fluctuate.....has been working well for several years. I have this one on one of my garands after the original plug failed after only 70 years..!!!

Ported Gas Plug - Garand Gear
https://www.garandgear.com › ported-gas-plug

good shooting.....Tom

[ffuries]

Ammo warning from CMP:

"Dear CMP Family,

The CMP advises to not use .30/06 ammunition in M1 Garands, 1903s, and 1903A3s that is loaded beyond 50,000 CUP and has a bullet weight more than 172-174gr. These rifles are at least 70 years old and were not designed for max loads and super heavy bullets. Always wear hearing and eye protection when firing an M1 Garand, 1903 and/or 1903A3 rifle.

This warning is an update/addition to the Ammunition section in the Read This First manual enclosed with each rifle shipment (M1 Garand manual-page 6 and M1903 manual-page 10)."

https://thecmp.org/sales-and-service/m1-garand/

[matt167]

I understand the 50,000 CUP, but isn't that the SAAMI maximum for 30-06? I know not to use heavy loads as the rifle was designed with 150 grain in mind, with the AP stuff being 168? I know that the Military did use some of the M1 ball, 175 grain boat tail in them early on.

Garandgear has a chart that shows most 150 grain is within the safe range comparing the pressure to M2 ball, even if it's not marked for the Garand, but the ported plug lowers that pressure even greater.

I don't expect to run 220 grain big game loads through it. Just modest 150 grain.

I found some Turkish M2 ball, but knowing that the turks loaded their 8mm very hot it makes me question if that turk ammo might really be too hot for the Garand

[steelbuttplate]

I understand the 50,000 CUP, but isn't that the SAAMI maximum for 30-06? I know not to use heavy loads as the rifle was designed with 150 grain in mind, with the AP stuff being 168? I know that the Military did use some of the M1 ball, 175 grain boat tail in them early on.

Garandgear has a chart that shows most 150 grain is within the safe range comparing the pressure to M2 ball, even if it's not marked for the Garand, but the ported plug lowers that pressure even greater.

I don't expect to run 220 grain big game loads through it. Just modest 150 grain.

I found some Turkish M2 ball, but knowing that the turks loaded their 8mm very hot it makes me question if that turk ammo might really be too hot for the Garand

What year is the head stamp on the Turk ammo.

[matt167]

MKE 64 is the headstamp. I have not bought any yet because I'm unsure..

I pick up my rifle tomorrow and the shop might have some M1 rounds. He tends to have the odd stuff

[tomaustin]

the grandgear plug has worked fine for me using commercial sourced ammo...the real problem starts when the handloaders want to change a garand into a 1000+ yard shooter by loading hot...the weapon itself was not designed for that. modifications come into play and now are you really shooting a garand or a different weapon on a garand platform....

in the army, I have shot garands on the 1000 yd targets with standard military ammo. range is not the question and no issue with harming the weapon. In 1961, I was training advanced rifle marksman candidates on the ranges in Colorado. I have used it as an effective weapon at that range----drop and crosswinds must be factored in......but it will put you down when hit.

[matt167]

The range I have access to has a max of I think 300 yards. I'm not shooting over 1/2 mile

[ffuries]

The range I have access to has a max of I think 300 yards. I'm not shooting over 1/2 mile

I don't think I can't even see that far anymore.......

[matt167]

dbl post

[matt167]

Here it is, From The Garand Guy in NJ. Total price was $1,535. I really didn't want the reproduction stock, but that is the way he had it listed on the website to get a good condition original barrel.\

My local shop didn't have any rounds for it. but he DID have some 6.5 Carcano which I snagged, and it was $18/ box so under $1/ round

[Junk Yard Dog]

Here it is, From The Garand Guy in NJ. Total price was $1,535. I really didn't want the reproduction stock, but that is the way he had it listed on the website to get a good condition original barrel.\

My local shop didn't have any rounds for it. but he DID have some 6.5 Carcano which I snagged, and it was $18/ box so under $1/ round

Remember, USGI spec M2 ball ammo unless you install the adjustable gas cylinder screw. Try it with commercial ammo that's not USGI M2 ball spec and you will batter the bolt and op rod to death. These were built to use that one specific round and did not have the capability for gas system adjustment. I have five rounds of M2 ball in my pocket right now that I found in a box of junk earlier today, not that it helps you at the moment. Joe in the for sale section has some Turkish M2 ball if you don't turn up anything local
https://russian-mosin-nagant-forum.com/ ... 28&t=20615

[matt167]

I'm going out tomorrow to see if there is any M2 ball spec ammo to be had locally. Have a feeling that the 30-06 shortage has cleaned the shelves of M1 ammo as it does go bang in any 30-06 not just an M1. I'm putting together a list for Joe since I'll need some Mauser too.

Until I get a different gas plug to adjust the pressure, I'm not running anything other than M1 spec FMJ, and I won't be running any soft point through it ever.

[Junk Yard Dog]

I'm going out tomorrow to see if there is any M2 ball spec ammo to be had locally. Have a feeling that the 30-06 shortage has cleaned the shelves of M1 ammo as it does go bang in any 30-06 not just an M1. I'm putting together a list for Joe since I'll need some Mauser too.

Until I get a different gas plug to adjust the pressure, I'm not running anything other than M1 spec FMJ, and I won't be running any soft point through it ever.

Soft point bullets are fine so long as the bullet weight, and pressure produced by the powder used is a match to US M2 spec. Wiki has this covered pretty well, scroll down to where it reads Cartridge, Cal.30 Ball M2

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.30-06_Sp ... 0in%201954.

[matt167]

Could I use a cheap Lee loader to pull the bullets out of hotter loaded 150 grain and load the correct amount of IMR 4895 for M2 ball?