An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

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captkirk222
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Location: Kansas

An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by captkirk222 »

Brace yourself- This is a long post with a second one needed for pictures.

I thought it was about time that I showed you guys the rifle that made me start thinking seriously about joining one or more of the various mosin forums. This rifle is the first and so far only M91 that I have any experience with and it was one heck of an introduction to the original model. This old warhorse has many tales to tell. From the moment I first saw it on the table at a local gunshow, it was calling to me with tales of victory and defeat, stalemate, good and bad times, distant countries, peasants and free men, bright clear days and the worst of storms, and it wanted to find more stories to tell to those who will care for it long after I am dust. This old rifle still has much life in it and a very strong voice for those with the ears to listen. If this rifle had a song that conveys how it feels to me, it would have to be one of the two versions of Undefeated by Two Steps from Hell. (you can look it up on Youtube, if you're interested in hearing it.)

Now that I got that out of my system :) , this M91 is the only one I have ever seen in person that still has an Imperial Russian barrel, other than the ones in our local National World War I museum and Memorial. (I have some cool personal links to that as well, but that is for another thread.) I thought it was just a fairly ordinary (for an M91) Austrian capture that ended up in Finland and I was perfectly happy with that, so happy that I didn't even care if the barrel was rusted out. I didn't have to work hard to convince dad to get it and I am glad that we did get it.

It looked like an 1895 Tula that had been upgraded and counterbored by the Finns and looks to have seen quite a bit of use over the many years. I could not for the life of me figure out what was up with this strange line through the barrel shank markings and these funny scratches on the sides of the receiver until we got it home and took it apart for our usual inspection of everything. Imagine my surprise when I found a tang date of 1914r and an Izhevsk bow very clearly stamped on the tang. I am still trying to figure out reasons why the Finns would do this, but if they saw fit to rebuild an old 1895 Tula that looked like it had already seen some pretty good action, it must have been worth it in some way and that along with what looks like a fairly late replacement handguard gave me something to hope for regarding the bore. I found my hope was not misplaced when we finally got to the range with some light ball ammunition, as we had already tried it with standard heavy ball and it did not favor that load at all. At our relatively short range it shoots almost as good as our 1893 Amberg Gew. 88/05, which I consider to be one of our most accurate rifles and we have brand new rifles that do not shoot that good.

Now for some of the details that I have managed to decipher from its tales.
It clearly saw service in the Great War as witnessed by the Austrian WWF mark on the reciever and what I think is a replaced rear sight base marked in schritten. The barrel itself looks like it was salvaged from the bottom of the ocean, although I know this is not the case. There is no visible import mark anywhere on it and the pitting looks like it spent a good amount of time without receiving a handguard. There may be a small W or M stamped in front of the rear sight base that I don't have a good picture of. This rifle at some point received a two-piece Finnish-made stock and got various upgrades and replacement parts. It still amazes me that the 1895 barrel has not only survived, but is in fine shooting shape internally. I guess the Finns don't hang on long to rifles that don't shoot straight. I still have many questions about why this and why that, so I am very open to opinions and observations that can result from more eyes looking at it. Thanks for reading my little rant! :biggrin:
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As long as it is capable of serving its purpose, it will never be obsolete.

Disclaimer- I cannot guarantee that what I type will sound as good in your head as it does in my head.
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captkirk222
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Location: Kansas

Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by captkirk222 »

More pictures are needed.
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As long as it is capable of serving its purpose, it will never be obsolete.

Disclaimer- I cannot guarantee that what I type will sound as good in your head as it does in my head.
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ParrotHead
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Location: Northern Ky.

Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by ParrotHead »

Image

1942 VKT M39 [1905]
1944 Tikka 91/30 [1915]
1940 Tikka M91 [1897]
1940 Tula [SA] 91/30
1935 Tula 91/30
1937 Tula 91/30
1928 5 line ex-Dragoon
1939 Izhevsk 91/30
1942 Izhevsk 91/30
1944 Izhevsk M44
Eddystone M1917 Enfield
1943 Shirley Enfield No 4 MK 1
1939 ERMA K98k
1944 Swiss K-31
1939 M1895 Nagant
CZ82

Image
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Lotema
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Location: Western Washington

Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by Lotema »

:thumbsup: That rifle sure has been around and seen some interesting things. Great example of how the Finns really would put any usable parts back into service. Looks like the butt plate may have a civil guard marking on it as well. Very cool rifle, thanks for sharing that one! :vcool:
Lotema
Argue for your limitations, and sure enough they're yours. -- Richard Bach
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redspoon
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Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by redspoon »

I would be proud to own that one, nice old war horse. Good score :vcool: :vcool:
81turbota
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Location: Southern CA

Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by 81turbota »

That's an excellent example that will leave you with many unanswered questions. There is something very special about that rifle, I'm glad it has a good home.

I'm very jealous by the way! :thumbsup:
1898 Tula M91 - SA
1929 Tula 91/30 - MO/53
1931 Tula 91/30
1934 Tikka M27
1940 Tikka M91
1943 Izhevsk M38
1944 VKT M39
1944 Izhevsk 91/30 PU sniper
1968 No maker M39

1941 Podolsk SVT40 - SA
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desdem12
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Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by desdem12 »

:vcool: :vcool: :vcool:
The commerce which maybe carried on with the people inhabiting the line you will pursue renders a knowledge of these people important ~Thomas Jefferson~ (to- Lewis and Clark)
racerguy00
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Location: Western PA

Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by racerguy00 »

Im really thinking the Austrians rechambered it to 8x50 and then the Finns sleeved the chamber back to.7.62x54 and installed the barrel on that receiver. Can you see any possible chamber sleeve from the rear with the bolt out?
On Facebook? Check out the non-sporter preservationist group at: OOOPS. Deleted by Facebook because it's evil to even discuss collectible firearms on social media these days.
john_the_plinker
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Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by john_the_plinker »

Beautiful, man, beautiful!!!! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
davesstuff1
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Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by davesstuff1 »

:Drool1: :Drool1: :Drool1: :big shock: :big shock: :big shock: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :pointup:
David M Gellatly
Savannah, GA. 31419
gellatlydave@yahoo.com
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bunkysdad
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Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by bunkysdad »

Super rifle there captain, it even has a initial K for Kirk! I like it. Now what is this talk of schritten? :facepalm1:
vtxmosin
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Location: Ohio

Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by vtxmosin »

Very nice, great find.
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Junk Yard Dog
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Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by Junk Yard Dog »

Lot of old ghosts in that one, very good find, early Finn import if there is no import mark, before 1968, part of the first batch of Mosins the Finn's let go of after the war. :)
Leave it as it is. The ages have been at work on it and man can only mar it.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
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JER
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Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by JER »

Wow, and wow again...
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catcracker
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Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by catcracker »

:bravo: :bravo:
81turbota
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Location: Southern CA

Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by 81turbota »

You should submit this for reference to the Mosin database at 762x54r.net
1898 Tula M91 - SA
1929 Tula 91/30 - MO/53
1931 Tula 91/30
1934 Tikka M27
1940 Tikka M91
1943 Izhevsk M38
1944 VKT M39
1944 Izhevsk 91/30 PU sniper
1968 No maker M39

1941 Podolsk SVT40 - SA
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captkirk222
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Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:22 am
Location: Kansas

Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by captkirk222 »

racerguy00- I have looked for signs of a sleeve in the chamber and I haven't seen any, but I still sometimes wonder. I may just have to get some pictures of it and post them for more pairs of eyes to scrutinize.

I'll have to tell the old gal how many compliments she's getting, maybe she'll have a reply :lol: .
As long as it is capable of serving its purpose, it will never be obsolete.

Disclaimer- I cannot guarantee that what I type will sound as good in your head as it does in my head.
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captkirk222
Posts: 28
Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:22 am
Location: Kansas

Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by captkirk222 »

I just noticed as I was looking at these pictures and the mosin showcase (I'm having trouble falling asleep) that martin08 has a 1905 Tula Austrian capture with a very similar, if not identical, letter Z on the barrel shank. I wonder what significance that mark is? Maybe we should throw up the moose signal?
As long as it is capable of serving its purpose, it will never be obsolete.

Disclaimer- I cannot guarantee that what I type will sound as good in your head as it does in my head.
TulaTom
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Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by TulaTom »

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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captkirk222
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Location: Kansas

Re: An Old Warhorse With Many Tales To Tell.

Post by captkirk222 »

Well, there has been a new development with this rifle today. Dad and I finally found an old Tula lockring bayonet that we like on ebay and went ahead and got it for around $75 without shipping factored in. Maybe I will have to update with some pictures of the added pointiness when that shows up. :biggrin:
As long as it is capable of serving its purpose, it will never be obsolete.

Disclaimer- I cannot guarantee that what I type will sound as good in your head as it does in my head.
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