Question on cleaning...

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ashtray
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Question on cleaning...

Post by ashtray »

Hey gang...been a while since I've posted or even commented..been busy with school :D

About 5 days ago I put 10 rounds through my 1929 Tula in INCREDIBLE condition...I have not been able to clean it and honestly do not think I will have the free time to do so until thanksgiving. I'm curious will this be okay? I bought my ammo from AIMsurplus the 880 count box with spam cans. Just curious if this is going to harm my bore. For the record I would normally clean it religiously right after shooting it because I had more time last semester and this past summer. Thanks for any and all replies guys.

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Ashtray
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WeldonHunter
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Re: Question on cleaning...

Post by WeldonHunter »

ashtray wrote:Hey gang...been a while since I've posted or even commented..been busy with school :D

About 5 days ago I put 10 rounds through my 1929 Tula in INCREDIBLE condition...I have not been able to clean it and honestly do not think I will have the free time to do so until thanksgiving. I'm curious will this be okay? I bought my ammo from AIMsurplus the 880 count box with spam cans. Just curious if this is going to harm my bore. For the record I would normally clean it religiously right after shooting it because I had more time last semester and this past summer. Thanks for any and all replies guys.

Best,
Ashtray

It won't be in incredible conditon for long if you don't clean it after shooting it with that ammo. It's military surplus, corrosively primed and will cause extensive bore and other damage if you let it sit with that stuff in it. If you value it make time to clean it, especially after shooting surplus ammo. Read this it may shed some light on what you should do. http://www.russian-mosin-nagant-forum.c ... f=5&t=6932
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Junk Yard Dog
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Re: Question on cleaning...

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Clean it immediately after shooting or your weapon will very quickly be reduced to a rusty piece of shit with a bore like a sewer pipe. The surplus ammo contains corrosive salts in it's primer compound, during firing these salts end up deposited in your weapons bore, and salt will pull moisture right out of the air to begin rusting the metal, sometimes within hours, there is probably already serious rust in your bore. It's easy enough to deal with, one quart of boiling water poured down the bore from the chamber, and then you clean the weapon with bore solvent as normal, and be sure to oil the bore well as the last step. If you do not have time to clean the weapon then do not shoot it, or your investment is gone.
Leave it as it is. The ages have been at work on it and man can only mar it.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
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millman
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Re: Question on cleaning...

Post by millman »

It only takes a few minutes to clean one. What is up with the "I have no time thing."? I don't get it.
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desert drifter
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Re: Question on cleaning...

Post by desert drifter »

I dont want to be piling on,but. The time it took you post the question and read the responses might have been enough time to clean your Mosin.

'drif
ashtray
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Re: Question on cleaning...

Post by ashtray »

Well whenever I clean it, I like to take my time and take the rifle completely apart since I do the boiling water method and dont want to get the wood wet. Anal that way I guess. Got heavy exams and labs on my hands. Posting this takes 1 minute, cleaning a rifle does not. I do not care who you are.
ashtray
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Re: Question on cleaning...

Post by ashtray »

Thanks though. Everything posted I already knew, just forgot if the ammo I bought was surplus since it has been so long. Over and out
zeebill
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Re: Question on cleaning...

Post by zeebill »

I don't worship at The Alter of Boiing Water and a minute or two of Windex on the bolt and bore followed by a wet patch or two of windex followed by a brass brush, followed by a dry patch o0r two, followed by a patch with any gun oil you chose to use and it is good to sit for awhile.

Regardless of what many think I have had a black powder rifle sit for well over two months and after soaking in bucket of hot water so I could get it apart (Sharps rifle falling block) and normal cleaning with solvents it looked like brand new and like nothing ever happend to it. I for sure don't recommend this but after thinking I totaled the rifle I was quite surprised at the great condition it returned to. I kind of wonder if maybe the Bore Butter and lead cartridges kind of protected it a bit? Black Powder is thought to be more corrossive than the primers and occaisional older and somewhat corrosive powder we deal with so I would say I stupidly tried to make a worse case scenerio there and got away with it somehow. Bill :oops:
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Re: Question on cleaning...

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Were you ill and unable to clean the rifle Bill? A sharps rifle has a considerable dollar value attached to it, I can't imagine you would be irresponsible enough to let such a treasure sit for that long after shooting without cleaning unless you had a very good reason.
Leave it as it is. The ages have been at work on it and man can only mar it.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
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Juice
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Re: Question on cleaning...

Post by Juice »

I am a BP shooter as well. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but BP fouling and the salts left behind from surplus ammo cause rust by absorbing moisture from the air. It's the resulting water that really does the damage.

So in theory, if the weather isn't too humid there might be less of a problem.

I clean every gun, every time. I haven't cleaned my .22s for two trips to the range and I am sure that's why my Marlin 60 was jamming.
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Re: Question on cleaning...

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My reenactment unit marched in the Remembrance Day parade in Gettysburgh and in the morning we shot a volley of honor at the Berdan monument near Pitsers Woods. By the time I got done the dinner that night and drove home to Delaware it was packed in the truck for a day or two as I worked still back then. We use reproduction rifles but you are still talking about $2000 with all the refinements I had on mine for live fire in the NSSA events. I brought it in Tuesday morning and set it in the safe not to look at it till Christmas week. I was sure I had destroyed it when I took it out of the safe and realized what I had done. Boiled two kettles of water while I stripped all the wood off it and after two hours of soaking and conjoling the block with a brass hammer the block slid out. I put it in another pot of boiling water and went to work on the barrel with just the water left in the pail and a brass brush. I put a fresh brush on and went after it with the solvent I used while target shooting with the NSSA and then back to the pail of water with a clean brush. The bore look awful good and I was overhwelmed at my luck. I suspect highly the Bore Butter I always used on the bore before shooting even blanks made for a protective coating on it and the leftover lead from the bullets I made myself no doubt helped too. There was no rust anywhere although I had to get oil on it while there was still water in there because the rust would then form quickly in the bore.

Now the block was grey black with just plain gunk for the lack of a better word. My block is custom made to use an O-ring and an Ampco firing plate, it looks like brass but is actually a super hard and resistant metal better than steel so they tell me. It all came off easily on the outside of the block and after water and just a brass toothbrush like thing I use all the time the outside looked brand new. The tube leading from the percussion nipple down to the fire cone at the rear of the chamber was another story. The are two 90 degree turns in that touch tube and it is tough to keep from fouling at the best when it is cleaned regularly. With that crap in there is took days and carefully used number drills to get that tube cleaned out. I then took it to work and used our special slurry wash equipment and blew that through the tube from one end and then the other. Believe it or not it shot better and cleaned easier after this very scary and stupid stunt I pulled.

The reason was stupidity and too much on the table at one time for which I claim all the blame plus old age to forget the rifle was never cleaned from an early morning shoot till two months later. What still surprizes me is there was not rust just a very grey and crusty like fouling over the whole bore and block which was seized right in place from setting. God watches out for idiots I guess! :oops: Bill
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Junk Yard Dog
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Re: Question on cleaning...

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Excuse me, I had to go hug my Sharps :) Once in a lifetime lucky, corrosive primers deposit rust in a bore that can start rusting in less than an hour under humid conditions, but black powder with saltpeter as a major component is far more corrosive to metals if not taken care of right away. I guess it was winning lotto ticket, or unrusted Sharps as your once in a lifetime lucky strike. :)
Leave it as it is. The ages have been at work on it and man can only mar it.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
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ashtray
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Re: Question on cleaning...

Post by ashtray »

Currently so dry where I am from that my skin is cracking...and it is in its sock in its case in my closet. Thanks again though.
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mrb7
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Re: Question on cleaning...

Post by mrb7 »

Juice wrote:I am a BP shooter as well. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but BP fouling and the salts left behind from surplus ammo cause rust by absorbing moisture from the air. It's the resulting water that really does the damage...
Iron (steel) rusts by oxygen, not water per se. The water, if present, acts as a catalysis in the process.

Witness that a water system like a circulating heat transfer system, for example a commercial building's cooling towers on the roof, will have an iron impeller pump because it's cheaper. The sealed system has little opportunity for excess oxygen to get in, and any small amounts of dissolved O2 quickly get scavenged out by minuscule rusting.

But a fresh water system, or one that is exposed to air like a hot tub recirculating system uses a bronze impeller because the water will continuously dissolve new O2 into itself, and the iron impeller will rust away rapidly.

So the water itself doesn't rust the metal, the O2 rusts the metal. But the water accelerates the process.

Chlorides, however, will directly attack the metal. And the corrosive primers leave chloride salts in the bore. The phenomena in high pressure systems is called chloride stress corrosion. Obviously the rifle's bore isn't under any tensile stress sitting in a rack after a trip to the range, but the chlorides are still reducing the iron by chemical corrosion, with or without water present. Albeit far more slowly without water. So South Carolina's high humidity is worse than Arizona's low humidity. But you don't get a free ride in Arizona either. The chlorides are still there even in the dessert. They just don't get an assist from the humidity like they would in a southeastern state.
Last edited by mrb7 on Sat Nov 10, 2012 1:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Question on cleaning...

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In short....clean your weapon....clean it before you eat, sleep, shit, shower, or shave.
Leave it as it is. The ages have been at work on it and man can only mar it.
Don't hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.
Theodore Roosevelt
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bunkysdad
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Re: Question on cleaning...

Post by bunkysdad »

Ashtry, I can understand you don't have time to get all OCD on your cleaning regimen, but I good and damn well guarantee you that you have time to run a few patches of Windex, Hoppes 9, and oil down the pipe and bolt head. Get it done man. The rest is total BS.
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